EXTRA BITS - More on E-Reader Text Layouts - Computerphile

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Название	:	EXTRA BITS - More on E-Reader Text Layouts - Computerphile
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This video has insufficient ears
Comment from : @icosmini

the text sizes available are limited so why not generate a lookup table for each text size available beforehand for the optimal layout memory is getting cheaper
Comment from : @ncgallagher

Agh! The "problem" of hyphenation and justification is real But it's a solved problem! H&J tables have existed for decades — I spent quite a lot of time in the 80's and 90s fine tuning H&J tables for electronic typesetting The Kindle's designers decision is perhaps explicable by CPU power in the early days but it's not entirely convincing as a reason for today or even 2014 when this video was madebrbrIf you don't want to devote cycles to calculating H&J on the fly you can do so when preparing the text adding discretionary hyphens at the appropriate word breaks Such discretionary hyphens are invisible until a word needs to be broken over a linebrbrAmazon's submission guide deprecates doing it but it is such an issue for readers that there are even e-book editors which will add these hyphens for you and they display exactly as designed on a Kindle allowing an acceptable appearance of H&JbrbrThe suspicion that Amazon's decisions are arbitrary rather than practical is heightened when considering its treatment of the em-dash — often used as expressive punctuation in narrative Amazon's guide says no space around the dash with the consequence that words—like this—that are treated as single entities and "words—like" would not break across a line on a Kindle The longer the words either side of the dash the uglier the resultbrbrUTF8 encoding (which the Kindle does use) has two possible cures inherent in it Either a thin or ⅙-em space either side of the em-dash or, even better, a zero-width space that would not change the look of the setting yet would allow the Kindle to treat the parts of the block separately (because they are delimited by spaces) and so break them over a line to improve the layout But Amazon deprecates this solution toobrbrSo many easy fixes to ugly, disruptive text flow are available that I now habitually edit e-books to add them before reading And they work both on the original Kindle keyboard and the PaperWhite
Comment from : @calmeilles

No annotation to this video in the main video
Comment from : @juneguts

"As your friend CP Grey have found "
Comment from : @LeonardNguyenSchyen

I am the-brrapist Bend over,brand spell 'run'br
Comment from : @qoaa

Oh! I played bananagrams once not too long ago Glad to see it's not that rare
Comment from : @mihaelrajh4249

I remember typewriters When the little bell rang, you could type in ten more characters before the hard margin hit (The hard margin would be ten spaces past the intended margin and the typewriter would not let you continue until you did a carriage return, changed the margins, or used a margin release) A lazy algorithm would break "insuf--ficient" The "bell went off" after typing the "i" You must use at least the first three letters and can only break between syllablesbrbrAs long as you have at least fifty characters on a line A lazy approach can produce fairly decent results No line will ever be over or short by more than 5 characters And that won't look too bad The problem with small devices is that they are not 8 1/2 inches wide
Comment from : @PvblivsAelivs

Wouldn't it be possible to pre-process the next page along with the most commonly used font sizes to solve the lag? This would also allow a more leisurely processing speed and save some battery life?
Comment from : @calvss

you know those "nice" layouts are made by people who's job it is to make it look "nice"brThe program does all this algorithmic stuff, but someone still has to finetune everything brit's only logical a small handheld device struggles with that task
Comment from : @enjoynocturne

So Kindle is like cheap paperback pocketbook series, there is simply not enough space to make nice layouts Once the screen is big enough, most of these problems are gone
Comment from : @retepaskab

My E-Reader mostly only displays PDF files
Comment from : @CelmorSmith

Something as simple as an e-reader isn't going to put much (any) processing power into it It'll just do the most basic algorithm (start new line if word can't fit) which we started with which is what word processors use and it's basically the core of all our typesetting
Comment from : @MrSlowestD16

One also what to limit of consecutive lines that end on a hyphenbrbrKudos for this well chosen example btw!
Comment from : @robin888official

This should have been part of the original video Brady!! Come on, this was the sinker It drove the whole thing home
Comment from : @gumenski

You wrote "Blah blah blah" instead of "Lorem ipsum!?" How are you called computerphile!?
Comment from : @NathanTAK

Excellent breakdown I always wondered why kindle didn't have a hyphenating optionbrbrI wonder too if publishers can dictate to amazon how they would like their works to appear on the various kindle devices (unique fonts, photos, etc)? Reading on a device certainly is convenient but the 'visual' component of having a professionally typeset book feels lost when using an e-readerbrbrEven more so when trying to read poetry, sadly
Comment from : @Rhodon506

What about the concept of precomputing, especially for it's own Kindles there are a finite number of kindle models and font sizes and files are downloaded directly to each device from Amazon Wouldn't it be reasonable to do this for at least the more common font sizes?
Comment from : @databoy2010

Hyphenating has other unwanted consequences too English has relatively simple hyphenating rules but that's not so true in other languages And I still have to see a program that would hyphenate eg czech language correctly Maybe there is one, I don't know What I'm seeing instead is people in my country slowly getting used to the travesty done to the language by english-by-origin typesetting programs used by newspapers
Comment from : @kasuha

HELLO? :)
Comment from : @ProfessorBorax

Definitely ready for the next HI podcast episode now that Brady has some more input
Comment from : @Car0linaPh03nix

Watching this and this pops up on my twitter feed: pbstwimgcom/media/B0DSn-tCcAI-yIljpg
Comment from : @euchale

I had a feeling this whole interview was just because of Grey Looks like I was right
Comment from : @sunsetsoverlavenderfields

I'm not convinced I still think Amazon just doesn't care Why would they not even allow the text to be left-justified if they gave two shits about typesetting?
Comment from : @unvergebeneid

I thought you could only hyphenate a word based on the syllables in that word Like the word "potato" could only be hyphenated as "po-ta-to" and "therapist" would be "ther-a-pist" But this is coming from grade school english a long, long time ago so I'm probably wrong
Comment from : @Ghost00117

Grey is going to hate this video
Comment from : @zacm1962

Computerphile bananagrams game anybody?
Comment from : @TheDiggster13

Couldn't Amazon give you the choice of downloading a file at a specific text size for a specific device pre laid out by a more robust algorithm? You would lose some of the features, but if you know the screen size and the user's desired font and font size it would solve the problem for most users
Comment from : @wbader19

"Which is similar to scrabble, other word-based games iare/i available" That made me laugh
Comment from : @troyadams19

I'm actually running into this problem myself trying to typeset a scientific paper in LaTeX Most of it works brilliantly automagically except for equations The real pickle is that many of my equations are too long for the double column layout and it just comes out the most horrid thing I'm having to just move on to more important things like the actual text of the paper for now
Comment from : @IsYitzach

Was expecting a comment from CPG Grey
Comment from : @piprod01

When reading novels I don't have a problem with the Kindle But when reading scientific books with equations and tables the kindle has a lot of trouble It cant handle superscripts very well
Comment from : @BeastOfTraal